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.ItJL-1 1-SAO WED 1 f5 _!SG tYpM: Dr: JameO yR,Epace DATr;: Tue 2D Mdr 90 1Z8 P - 1 G pROGRAMME: Ll-!ICH'1'Ol+'i SM~~'H TIM6: 11.36 a. u{• PAGE hEIGHTON SM~TI~; L~r. James Repace is a phyaioist~ with the Indoor Air Programme of the US Envir4nmental PrQteotiQn Agenoy in Washington. His prQfessionall responsibilities involve risk assessmOnt of zick buildings indoor pollutanta, including envirosxmen,tal tobacco smoke. Dr. Repace goo JAYXS REP~.CBt Good morning. Hovr are yau SMI I'm very well thank you and thank you for your time, Passive sm just hrn,r pe,rious is i.t. REP I think it'e one of the ma~or anvironmGntal public health probtG: of oi;r timme. Ther* have beat estimatds in the i3nited Stat+es that there a. upwards of 50 thousand deaths a year from pavs,ive amQk,ing and that would include lung oancer, heart disea$e, cancers of other organs of the }aody respiratory dieease. F ITx: How much does airConditioningr what role does ai.rconditionirig p, in that. ~EP~;,~ A3,r conditioning of cQursef we're talking about things like Legionne#a., hypors+snWitive pneumondnkt-is-.~a)~er Aok' *°,ma~QZ "uxce.;af moita: but; they 'g3•gni.:EiCent pj~obZem in. any. ,.bujldjng::.Where you ha'N contamination of the ventiiation system with Legionella bicteria or 0 oonta,mination of the water with L09ionellsa you oaLn get af aztal, d3sease CJ ~ ~ when the Qrqanism penetrates your lung . And when I talk about oonkamiria,t: ~ of water, for eXample it was found in the Medi,terrmn+pa,.n countries that many of them used relatively low temperatures in their elevtrio wattr heaters and in the hote1s around the Mediterranean they ha:i-, aA ep3.demic of, Legionella, people taking showers, the water temperatuxe in the CONT L• & : a O (n

'JUL-11-90 WED 1c.=57 Ce: D WHSH DO ~~~M; Dr, ~iunas ~tepaca pA7F; Tug 2QL Mar 90 STATION: iZB P . 1 r PROdRAMME: LEIGHTON SMTTH TIMEc 11. 36 a.mFMGE, 2 REpACB, contd hcaterswasn't anough to kill the bactaria, when you ~..•r----- tur,ned the showers on'they would get a full dose of Legionella =gmithzCrt whiie taking a showtr. SMITHs How long ago w,as that. PZpACr.: That was a couple of yeaxa ago, I thi'nk thoy'va cured that prOb1 since then, they did" an epidemiologica1 study to figure out what was happening and when they didr they cured it ~ust by turning up the temperbture in the water heaters. But this cornmon source of aick building problems is people,try to save money and they do aMathing in the buildirj, that saves the building owner money but people in the building get sick a: t he cost of pxoduot,ivity ia a great dea3,mr?re than heating or cooling. SMY is it a relatively recent phenomenan R~~CEi No it Ssn't. Wel3l relatively recent in terms of the 20th century yes>lit raa,lly etarted in the United 5tates, C*zta3.n1.y in many industriaL coun~rias in the early 70's when we had the oil crisis and the price of heating oil went up in an order of magnitvde and people staxted worrying about saving m4ney, by cutting off vent1lation in buildingsr by making buildings very tight, all actions that tended to reduce the aRVount of air N exchanqe in buildings. And, of course, the 1evela of Indoor pol3,ut$.on ~ then went up proportionately. The ventilation systam is your first line of ~ dOfence and although many build.inga, particularly in a warnm climate like 0 th.is; 4*sll have w3ndowa that open 'there are certciinl.y many times of the ye ~ when thoy don't and you're dApenderit on the central airconditioning sy$tem to provide air and it zecirculates pol3.utants around and whether you have 9trrds frQm coughing or sneezinq, influen2a is a good one, it's carried CON

JUL_ -11-90 WEL 16 :S r C G: R LJfiSH DC; P_ 1:D ~.+~ . vn. , r wF~ utiCn~4« AlJti3iLAhiD { TEM; James Repace pROt3FtAMMELEIGhTON SMITH Da7E. ,TuQ 20 Mar 90 STA7i0N: 1Z8 7IMSc 11.36 a.m.PACaE: 3 imgACL. __contd; on the air, or you have oombuation related pollutants 14 those froza environmental tobacco amokee they will dfaseminate throughQut the building a,nd people will get exposed and when you consider that peop spend 90% of their time at hom.e and at work, and most, for that for moat people is indoors, then you understand that the levels of indoor air pollution tend to dominate peopl,e' a exposure to pollutants, The Snvironmental ProtectSon Agency did a study in areas where they have hea r,he.mica]l industry, ' States of New Jereey, States of Louisiana and Te,xaa, they had heavy outdoor air pollution from the petrochemical industry and indeed, when we went in and sampled t,.hose areas we found heavy levels of outex air pollvtion. We also samplod areas like North and $outh Dakota wl are, very sparsely iopulated, are very cold and breezy -and had very prist: levele 09 cutdoor air pol,3ution. Amazingly, however, the levels o4 indoQ: aRir ; p6llution in the pristine area.s of the Dakotas and in the heavily polluted areas of Texas and New Jereoy were almost ident#.aal. And that' s because the human activities which generate indoor pollutants are pretty much the sa;ne, not only throughout our oountry# but throughout the in$u$trialivad world and so the levels of indoor air pollution tend to be similar and many fold (?)/ maniiold(?) in the outdoor air This doesn't mean outdoor air pollution is unimportant or shouldn't be aonsidered or xegu3.a,ted and controlled it certainly should, Because it is a source of human morbidity and mortality but what we now have to deal with are thesq= relatively new phenomena brought about by the sealed building, of indQor n ~ air pollution. C © ,I :M=TH: So we'.-e booQming a sicker aoCiety in general in our oountry, 0n youx country, you know, other countries with sS.milar s*a,ndards, CONT >~~~.

J'1JL-11-9r3 LJED 1b:S8 C,x I3 WASH Dl'.:: P_ 39 r.V~+v.~+~ ~ 1'.a.tc. L~-s-~T1~L1L+ ACJLi~4L11' ~IQ tT9M: '. 13r. : Llamee 1tbpace PAOpRAMME: LEiGHTON SM1TH 4ATEt 'j'ue_ 20 t3A-r 90 $TA7i0N: 1 ZB 1"1ME, 11.36 a. Tit. PR4Ei 4 REpAEe_ I t~in3s this ia unquestionably txue. The Society of Ventilation Engineers, which ia an international society,, ha.s been very much concerned about Oia problem for anumbez of yezarv, they were in the forefront of adviein~q people to reduce ventilation ratts and when they did, they di+ac4vex that they 'got a lot more vick buildings and of course, a lot more ventilatic engineers raerd b'eing, sued so they quickxy rsspondod with standards for ventilation 'for acceptabla indoor air quality. One of the problems we have i the, Un3.~ed Staes ia that they were not we13l accepted because p6op1e were mor interested in saving mnney than they were in public health in buildings. SMITH; Al3l right, what rang~s of dioez~ees can we catch from sick brxild~.n~~ RBFRCM Well you, can catch a wide variety of diaeases ranging from infectiQua diseases like influenza, common co1d, ranging to cancer and prdbab: heart diaease by passive sm4k#.ng. SMI~ A13, right, why cancer REPLACE. Wel.l wa'ra talking about genex4ting environmental tobacco smoke from cigars, cigarettea and pipes And, of course, we know the effects in , active smokers aza cancer, heart dieease, respiratory disaase. Well those disoaaeN dcn't only occur in active smokers whoever breathes the tobacco smoke itgding to be at risk for those diseases aa well and that includes the non .emoker, from the pollution oi' indoor air, by envircnmental tobacco emoke. SM?TH: What about a3,rconditioning on a.exopl&neS CQNT

' JUL-11-90 LaED C & D YJASH DC P. ?0 aCe : PKvUMAn~nnt :n~nnt: 5Mi•-Vz {YEM: Nattta# Ro x W. p aATF-.. Tue.2.Q_XaX~_" -- sTArIoN: lZB TIME: • 11. 36 a. m. PAGE: . 5 RBp~ Acz: Wall ,t.hat' s axubj ect that' e very olose to me. I wag on the pepartrpent of TrarispQxt~atio.n in the United States Advisory Committee on oab~ ~ . air qu4lity and -wa did astudy, I was 'on the oversight aommitt", a contractc did the Study, and made mBaztirexnentg oil tobacco smoke* microbiqlogiCalg I air exch"gt ratea, carbop dioxide, lpoked at the issue of o.zone and rad,iation a$ well on airc~raft, and they concluded that, of course, there were major problems relating to envirdnmontal tobacco smoke and, of course, lour Congress has restricted smoking to flights only over six hours and that izcludas, by the way, intexnationml carriers who serve domestic points withi: the United statea. k'or sx~mpla, on my trip here, on Rir New Zealand, they served, •= got on the plane at Los Arig$les and flew to Honolulu and Air New Zealand banned smoking on that f,light in oompliance with United States Govar=ent regulations. When we left MonoZulu for New Zea1and, then they allowed empking on the airp3ane and, of course, the air quality sYegradod. ' tremendoua 1y, SMI So if, if we banndd cigarette smoking #roxn &11 flights, everyone, 100% (Repacet Yes) would ibere be a telling difference in the way you folt whsA y0u got of f at the e~d of a flight. REp ;oh there would be 'an enormous difference particularly for individuals who,happer, to have pre-rexisting respiratory or cardiovaacu3.ar disease, ~ It would be an enormoue difi'erence. The biggest difference however would be ~ for the poor individuals, the f3.iqht att*ndants, who have to work on the Z: O airplane, xn,the smoking a~otrion and that is a great punishment. I'va O ~.nter~riaiaed parsonal~.y many flight attendants before and after the ban and O before the ban they were v*ry, very bitter people beo$uae a lot of them are very highly motivated, they love their work, many of them felt they could not make that their life career because they just could not Stanca the nnNm

3LJL-11-~~ WED lo :S'3 C & E LJr=i^H DC P. 21 P.v. t~Dx z 7~5~, ELi.F.RSLlE. AUCKLAND iTEM Dx. Jxunes Repace PAMPAMME. LbZCHxdN SM1TH DATE: Tue 20 Mar- 90 S'rATiOtJ: 3.ZS TIME: 11.36 a.m, pADE: 6 REP ACEs contd 1eve1s.of smok+a on airpla.nes, it's cxtzemely debilitatir bQcau6e it' a ver^y low humjdity on the airplane, the cabin pressure is equivAient to-being at 8,thousattd feet of altit2de so thexe's not much 'air vp therre and the combination of w6xking in the smokitYg section pushing thea heavy 'carts: really up azad down hill bacause the plane is rievsr quite level so you're always pushing a 254 lb cart either uphill or keeping it from sliding down a slope, you're doing a lot of work, you're doing deep knee bend$ and you're breathing a lot of stnoke and it's a great pwnishment, even for the smokers who are f]: ight attendanta , I've had them complain to me . After tha restrictions on 6moking I haven't extensive dmtsa on thio but a larga pumber of, flight attendants that i-. talked to on the, flight down here, very positYw$ly-viewed the new restrictione, DMIAll right. Aeroplanes aside, as far as bui].dings are cono6rzled air conditioning in buildingz, are we making eatisfactory pxogreos do you think REP~ACE.~a,'No I don't think we are, I think there' s a great deal that needs t, be done. We have not, as a society, an industrial Nrcietyr paid much attention t4 the quality of indoor air in our b,uil.dir,gs. We alsow indis- criminate smoking in many cases to go or,, genarating a whole variety of pollutants , we atlow our ventilation systems to become' contamir4ted wi-th standing water, we put carpeting exterisively in buildings without any real appreciation of the fact that carpeting has a very high surface area co].3.eots dust and dirt, just dumping carpet shampoo on it ~ust adds another pollutsnt to the building and it also, when you w,alk on it, it re-entraine dirt into the a.ir. It looks niea, it keeps the sound 1evel down but it's a major probiem. In the Scandiriavian countriea they looked at a numbsr"of Aanish town ha11s and they found that the so»calI'ed fleecing factvr that is tha amount of fleecing materials like carpeting that they had in 4 CON

JFJL-11-?Ei WED 17 :00 C& E wASH DC P_ 2 2 1sv#~ ~ ~-OW, tuARSUE, AUCKLAND YTEM: • Dr. Jameft Repace Pfic'GRAMME: LEIGHTON SMITH DATE: Tue 20 mar 90 BTATlON: 1ZS TlME: 11.36 a.tmt3E; 7 REPACE; contd: building was a predictor of whether the buixding was sick or not. The more f1e6cing material they had in a building, the hightr the ratea ; of sick bu3,lding type complaints. 5MI So !this soundproofing that you eee around the -studic wouldn't be contxibuting'td great .health eithex. It's very porbus,it's sponge in faot REPACE= Yes if it's'-sponge that would again contribute to it. There are E ldts 6f things you 0an do aoquat3.cal1;y that don't raquire porous matexials I to reduce sound. ~ i SMI Well lQoking around you 'and seeing the 6tate ol this plaoe yQt i 1 . " be very p1eaoQd to know that we're mpving' out of here in a matter of days RE„~ PACE:1 congratul.ate you on that . j SMI~:T, ,A.nB it's coMing ddwn and let me tell you we' re all looking Eorward to it, f Thank you viex•y , much for your tiime , good to talk to you. ~ ~ 1 REP It' s been my pleasure, thank you. ENDS N DURATION: il m 25 sec (685 secffi) ~ ~ N