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1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13. 14 15 19 20 21 22 23 24 DI;,iP.ICT COLttT DI: TRICT CF YORK Civ. Action 1,Io.74 Civ. 2695 - CES FaILIP I•10:w IS IL7CGFtrGRF.T: D, ) Plaintiff, ) ~ v. ) ) R. J. REDVIOLflS TOT ACCO ) .CO,v1PF-1IY G: d «TILLIAM, ESTY ) COz.YpoTY, rx. , DEfendant ,. ) DEPOSITION OF II. COPELAND ROBINSON, JR. APPEARAF. CE S Plaintift: 7,ntlro:;y L. Fletcher and Timothy C. Quinn, Jr. , Attorneya - Ce;z-hoy, 1'.c%•ritt, O'Brien & 13oarc'rman, 20 Exc2-.ai:ge Place, Vew York, New York 10005 Defen::an:s: R. brudl:e Doal, Attorney - Cooper, Dunham, Clar'.:, Griffin & moran, 30 Rockefeller P1M4a, p;cw York, 2:^w York L. Alfrod wilson, Atto_nay, R. J. Reynol4s Industries, Inc., winsto::-Salem, North Carolina 27102 ~ * * 4 ifr * t * * Bo;:sn Ross and Jack Koach, Attarneys,. L=V c_;:at .& Ai'Vers, Inc., Du_ham, North Carolina The deposition of H. Copeland Robinson, Jr., was taken on December 16, 1974, at the Holiaay Inn, Durham, P}orth Carolina, bevinninq at 2 s 00 P. M. , in the presence of 25 1 counsel he--einbcfore stated.

1 ...~..~T•. -~~... 1....•..1.- ~ r 3 ~ 4 ?9 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 I 19 20 21 22 23 2 4 Lt~End~ 4 -„ .9 r u6 ~f ...' T .. I ".• 2:.:.5 . 2.4 «r ~.~..+•. ..~... ~... ;. '. - , .._,E i 52 12 22 25 29 31 32 33 35 39 45 !5 49 52 25

1 I . 2 --; 2 L% aTR. 3 B3ir_g first duly sworn, was examincd I ~ 4 and tc: ,tificd a:; follo-as: 1 ~ 5 6 T.'?:1s-:-iTl?'.A1^.IGh rsY 12. fiOALs ? Q. Mr. RoIbinson, will you give us your full name and 8 home addresu? ~ 9 A. 2122 Ncrth Lakeshore Jr. Copeland Robinson H ! , , . 10 Drive. ~ 11 Q. By «hoca are you er..ployed? ~ 12 13 A. Q. L;ggett & Myez s, Inccrporated. For how lcng have you been c.r:.ntoyed by Liggett i i i i ~ 14 & t:~•::rs? ~ 15 A. Sy...~co February first, 1951. 16 Q. And what are your present responsibilities for 17 Liggett & 2'.yers? ~ 18 A. Pxcscntly I am Dirc•ctor of mar}.cting Services. I 19 have prir;iary recponsibs ities for the media and 20 ptiblic rclations of the tobacco division. ; 21 Q. For how long havc you had that responsibility? 22 A. T::at particular rc:::ponsibil.ity, three or four years . 23 Q. Could you outlir.e your enplo}rocnt history with . 24 Lic;;:: t-,t &k:y`rs, giving us the times and dates i i 25 when you have had various positions and a r 0 a w A -

A. As ;x:st I can in chronological dating, I 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 joined, as I caid, in '51. b1y first title was Iissistant to the Vice President of Advertising wh; ch is about an advertising department of two people. Within two or three yaars after that, about two I su3p3ct, my title changed to Auvertiaing manager for Liggett & Yyers. I stayed with that title until approxirnatcly 1965 when I was Director of Brand ?dana3ement. That would be 165 to 171, 172 wcan I took this title. And pr for to 1951 by whom were you employed? . A. N3t:ell-Errm_*t, khichh was the predecessor of Cunningham & Walsh which is the advertining agency for all of our cigarette brands. Q. hixen you say ' all of our' you mean Liggett & Myers advertising? A. 1t that all of our cigarette brands, that's c.orra:. t. Q. Did you work on that.account at that time? A. Yes, only. Q. That is, you worked solely for Liggett & r:l•ers? Solely fcr L:+.; g:-tt & 23yers. 25 1 Q. I hava aqro-ip of Chc-,stcrfield ads, the first three

Ir 4 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 12 14 15- 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 b~-ia7 a3, dat^! P:c:vc-•-b;cr 192.7, 1932, and 1940, prior to t: eWit:~ess' cr:p} cy tvi t'~ t?~e Lig7(:tt & r:yers Cc:,:rnny, ar.d, as I u,~~e_ s ta.~d it, you don't rc,--cg^i" these eFsciflc ads? A. 2'0, s ir, I do riot. MR. BOAL: tir'all, I wonder if you have any objec':iGn to the autherticity of those ads? 2.R. FLETCsTER: r:'o. I will stiaulate that thry were chesterfield ads as of the time you stated. N,R, BOAL: O',cay. MR. FLETCFX.R: F::cuse me, may I sea thera for just a cecond? tdt, BOAL: Sure.,.. I ask the reporter to r::azk tt.cse as Defendant Liggett Exhibits lA, B, and C, (!'.RRY.ED FOR ITiEIeTIFICATION) (Mr. Loal) In Defendant's L & M Exhibits lA, 1B, ar.d 1C, the word 'lir.ht' is upEd in the body copy cf tl~ose e:{js :;7,its, ' light' in a vc-rbal. scn.se I think. Does it .z f: liSht Up your Chcsterfield? A. Light up your first Cnestrrf.ield. ~. HavL you cf nr. that kind of use of ' licht'? A. Yes. Q. In zdve=ta.Fi: g over the ycars?

5 .. 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A. G~,;:tzin1_ . Q. ry ? A. A. I w:.clil aay rrc,~.^,,a:atly. is it a coi~xnaa usc: of ' 1i.ht' in this business? S-r_kh, 13.,~ht a ci.carctte, cc.rta.tnly. Q. I have here a page from the r.lagazine GIRL TALK, the sucn:::r of 1970, and ask if you recognize that GIRL TAL•K ad? . Yes. It's like a nu.-,,ber of ao.s, looking the sans. This oze hal?pvned to be pi:.blis'led in GIRL TALK. ir:::at v'.s the occasion •fnr that; was that purt of a particular c:.~.~aig*~? : F. The svT-,aer of 170, this is about the introduction of. eul-- vnfcrtunate picture packs for Chesterfield ar:.d we r.r.n very little ac?vertising on C'r.estezfield during that period. That's about it. Q. Whcn you say 'uI'lfoZ'tliE3ate', this kas-- A. xk•ut's a co-r.par.y picture packs didn't help ,,n b::.rn-.r.3 vezy muc_. _., Q. And is ' 1ic.:-.ter' used in' t.he copy? A. Yes, 3ir., Q. In that ad? A. (14I':-'::: 0133 NCDS :-MAJ AFFZZ~:ATI'JELY) (;.. Ar3 ic- iaVin :c3 to ba conveyed by the use of L, 0 N r 0 OD w ~o

I 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6 the {.:::rm _~F:r' i.r; "i :.0t r,axti.cular ad? iIR. FL1 Tc:L;:R: Objection to the for:a of the c,+t.e.;;,io:2. I dcn 't ti:izix you have establisY.ed this quali.ticAtions to answer to the intent of th-3 ad, that is, at this point. It may be possible to do so. N:Ft. EOAL: All right. Q. (I•':. EGal) Did you have. z:ny role in developing the ccpy.for that? A. No. Q, Did you r:avo aiiy 4pFroval= did you have any responsi- bility of any hind for that ad? . : A. 1Fa, e::cEpt its placein:©nt. Q. Ex::cpt its placer.:cnt. Do you understand the copy A. A. in that ad? Certainly. .is it obvious to 1 ou as to what the intent of the uzY of t1: o word 'ligt:t' is in thaL ad? G:wic•us in i:3y' ce::'_e~:" , v~.s. j•;e11, ti,'rsot is it? rm. rLrTCi:LR: t;cll, I objact again to the fo:.'m of the question. I don't think that any of the issuc:s in this csse is whr,t is obvious or not to Q;e wit.r.o-ss. -4fie queotion isc what does it mean 0

1 2 3 4 5 6 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 r 7 to C:= co:at:.-:~:g p:iLli c, 2' :. :;OP,;r: lWcll, I thin:: t: at this witn^s,s-- FL:.::.:'.~.'R: I will poiat out, also, that he cur.'t :;L~tify La to tY e izitent of the ad. t;R, n0,r3L: As to t:.e i,-itent of the ad, okay. Q. (Px, iso:.3.) Is thc••re. z,.r.y pu»pose in the advertising COE) y f::,: :: ~:? The purpo;,e of this Plrtivilar advcytisin; is prE- sL::,ably to introduce the pic!:+.irQ pack and to r.;r.ke it clear that t.t-.,.re are coi.Fcr.s on those packages. 01 Does the c: 14y 11ave a.ly purF•:~we? . A. ac}•.er than the noa-mal cig :r;:tte langu:::go, of Which t'l_irn isr.'t very much, no. b~ And is is`e.:e any hwpose to the normal cigarette lt:nguac~P u::ed? I 4oa't un.darstand the cuestion. The purpose of the 1::.2s;u,:,,y_ is to ES1> C1J~:~~tCB. Q. t::.:. tKyare a pL:.;ez-5^ for thz~.; .~:irticul«r--v:::s there a rcazan fcr c::::osi^a t+':e Far-ticulur copy that was LzCd? A. Iyou are rcserrir.g to 11 ightcr' ,'sraoothc+' pzrticulGrty, aren't you, and I can't cay that there we.s =iy in that. Q. Decs t12»t hw•: :.ziy racaning to you? ~ 0 N A a 0 (b c .W4 :

1 3 4 5 ? 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 .25 8 A. r>• R: uait a ninute. I cbject to t'::.t is Y,~:yinniz:g is net respcasic:_, I i,•;.;.:. t;.}:c a ycs cr r.o an:,•ker to that and then o?;jcct to ti:a follcrpup u~:estion. Q, (tn,r, toal) If it has an y neaning to you, answer y~s or no? A. Yes. Q, O:4y, wil:at is that me«r_ing? Fz1?=::c:E::a:: Gbjccl%-.ion for the reasons stated l;cic+e: Mt;, uOAL: o:.ay, you Ciln answer the question. ; :5r.. FL::TCr::U;: ?=:at is up to his counsel. „~. +~ Q~S. . C;-s••i~T'. t...l. a. J A. :.t's o}:ay wii:h ns, because as far as I'm concerned this ? G:r.guage is really cigarette pLffiery. It ~-r •-111Y d~acribcs t::.: fact t::4t tha cigarette is a ~+ ..L l..L,4-. ::: tcista:.an so:aa oi:her cigarette. :::M c.Cr6s 'lig: lLer', 'smovtr:er' have u*'.jT n^ .. t0 ~ ^ ,i~ 'scaoo;::cr' kou d tc wcrw cc_:~:~cc t':aL it is lczs LT!.°sh than its co:r:petitior.. is its cL:,: c)c:i.itiCA? ;. 3:. i- c'=: : it;; tion t:ould prob:tbly b© a].l c ti

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 - 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 9 i}:a, Ive've . ..+ u i.....r gv1. ,. so tr ic is 7.., cvcry- L~uy, ha t,c i:~.::C:_cu's, all ti.a cic,hty-five's, and ull c;::ic:- is a lo:.g list. I~:.".. -FL]:Z Cs:a : E:c4cz;e me. M.ay I see that ad for a r::.m::nt? i_:x. SiI9.'"J.7.iSS= Yes, six. 1t":. t3-.ir:3: that if we're going to. r refer to these things, why don't we mark them. A',R. LG2:L: 1'"cs. The rr>porter will mark the CIF,L TA%: ad us Defctldu; t's L & ti Exhibit 1D for ic:: nicif icut• A1.cn, l 2-;Fc. : LETCMa: Just, fou know, r•ot to pre- etapt- ycu or anything, but can cie agree that these are all filtcred eigarc•:ttes? A. Y3:,, :ir. 1•.Ti. Fi.,:7Zi-::::: 11.:.1 So when you're `. ».- +,~~•~~t.. ' r •w, ~ .ou Irc tulk g ~ o n r, ~~._..r r cir ~ ;. Y•.. ..'~out . . .~. Yc:., sir. A.•3 Carie 1J c and Lucky 1 W >n .• ...1 ; tr~.a:cs you wcre resfor:ing to were thc Carnel and ::. would ?;:c c= chicf coc::l,ctition, ycs, sir. t S , I ; b