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Council for Tobacco Research

Deposition of Freddy Homburger, M.D. [Deposition of Homburger in the Matter of Broin]

Date: 27 May 1997
Length: 148 pages
CTRMN041967-CTRMN042114
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Ctrmn00041967-2810
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Author
Bohan, A.H.
Homburger, F.
Depository Date
08 Sep 1997
Box
267
Type
TRANSCRIPT
UCSF Legacy ID
mmt30a00

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Page 103: mmt30a00 Log in for more options!
102 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 A. (Witness reviews document) Here is one in 1971, publication on "High Nicotine Tolerance of Syrian Golden Hamsters." So that was before that. On November 7, 1969, the use of inbred Syrian hamsters was first suggested by us for the study of the effects of rodent viruses on tobacco smoke effects then proposed by Dr. Sim of Yale who wished to join us for this work. CTR declined to support this project. m So in '69 we were already working with the smoking machine inhalation. Q. Maybe my question wasn't clear, Doctor. Let me try that again. The contract you entered into with CTR in -- that you returned to CTR on June 19, 1970, was the contract to start the Syrian golden hamster inhalation project which you eventually published the articles we discussed, correct? A. That's probably correct. Q. So when you entered the contract on June 19, 1970, neither you nor CTR knew what the results of that work would be, because it hadn't been started yet; isn't that correct? A. That's right. Q. Now, Dr. Homburger, you've been critical of DORIS 0. WONG ASSOCIATES L.r -rR Nf "S 0`°f' 20C'.~ 9
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103 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 the federal government for refusing to fund some of your work, haven't you? A. Yes. Not just for refusing to fund some of my work, but for refusing to support studies in that direction. I didn't care particularly whether we would get support or not -- we had already the support from the British -- but I was very concerned that this method would be forgotten, which actually is what happened. Q. And you criticized the government in some pretty strong language in the public arena, haven't you? A. I believe so, yes. Why not? Q. As a matter of fact, you, after the government had refused to fund work in areas you thought they should and rejected applications from you in that area, you've said that they were stagnant; do you recall using that phrase? A. Stagnant? Q. Stagnant. A. Well, that's a mild expression. Q. And at one point didn't you say that the control of grants in the federal government was an oligarchy of the few controlling the grants? DORIS 0. WONG ASSOCIATES CTR ~'~~~ 0~-~'~'~';" ``.
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104 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 A. Was an oligarchy; did I say that? Q. I was asking you if you said that. A. It's well said. Q. It is well said; it's picturesque. And what did you mean, what do you mean by that? A., I meant that they were derelict in their duty to the-public health. Q. And why were they derelict? A. Because as the work with the British/Celanese Cytrel cigarette showed, it was possible to demonstrate that a safer cigar-ette was achievable, and our government agencies ignored that. Later the cigarette companies, Dr. Gori, did these dilatory tactics by giving contracts to the Institute in Philadelphia, where he probably still works or where he worked after leaving the NIH. Q. What do you mean by dilatory tactics on behalf of Dr. Gori? A. Well, as he wrote me himself, it would never be possible to develop our method because of certain Senators' positions, and he didn't try. Q. Do you have a copy of that letter? DORIS 0. WONG ASSOCIATES C µI"R PIN 04~'01" 1
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105 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 A. I think so. Q. Did you look at that letter this morning? A. Not this morning, but very recently. Q. Once again, if you have it handy -- A. I'll see whether I have it. Q. I wasn't clear, were you blaming Dr. Gori for being dilatory, or are you blaming the Senate for being dilatory? A. Well, everybody. I mean, I informed Senator Brooke from Massachusetts of this situation, I informed Speaker O'Neill and John McCormack. I lobbied for money for the Public Health Service with Mary Lasker's group long before I was familiar with the ways in which to influence this legislation and this funding. So I used my knowledge, to no avail. Q. So let me see if I'm clear on what you. did. You applied for funding with the government to do hamster inhalation work? A. Yes. Q. And they turned you down? A. Yes. Q. You then lobbied a number of influential politicians and people in the Public Health Service to try to get this sort of work started, didn't you? DORIS O. WONG'ASSOCIATES [..r r R V-1f"3 S...A`°'f',~~0`f t2
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106 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 A. Yes. Q. And they all told you no, didn't they? A. They didn't do anything. Q- They didn't do anything. Why do you think they didn't do anything? A. Because of the tobacco interests. I mean, this is by now very obvious that the tobacco means big money, not only for politicians but for a whole living of whole states is based on tobacco income. Q. Let me see if I understand your testimony. Are you saying that you believe that the Tobacco Working Group, the National Cancer Institute, the Public Health Service and the U.S. Congress were all in a conspiracy with the tobacco industry to shut down this area of research? MS. SCHNEIDER: I object to the form. A. I wouldn't call it a conspiracy, but it just happened to go in that direction. Q. Well, it just happened, or was someone trying to make it go in that direction? A. Well, you know that as well as I do. Maybe better. Q. Well, since I was about 13 years old when this happened, I really don't. DORIS O. WONG ASSOCIATES ~TR NN 042,0`3

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